Gay marriage/relationships

FINALLY!

What are your opinions on gay marriage.
I don't think it should be allowed because:
- It will be taught in schools.
- Allowing gay marriage will spread that it's not a bad or odd thing at all to our children.

And for those wondering, Prop. 8 (the California prop. 8 about gay marriage) was passed, which means gay marriage will once again be unrecognized by the state of California.

Please note that the rules are in effect here and anyone violating those rules will be asked to leave this debate. Keep yourselves under control, because although this is a debate, I'd like it to be a civilized one. Thank you.

Alright, now that this section has come up I can give a rebuttle to your two statements without flaming.

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It will be taught in schools

This isn't really that much of a problem when you think about some of the other things taught in schools that are biblically or morally wrong. Segragation is involuntarily taught through labels and stereotypes and people have lived up to those standards for years because they never thought about it.

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Allowing gay marriage will spread that it's not a bad or odd thing at all to our children

Yet again, this isn't that big of a problem because it isn't a bad or odd thing. This statement is proof that you haven't really read up on the issue and are only going off of emotional standings. I'm not going to attack you, I'm just trying to really get a debate off of given information instead of just thoughts and feelings. Prop 8 will only change the School curriculim Academicly which means only the small portions of Constitutional Chapters will contain information that gay marriage has been legalized in California. Not to mention the issue of gay marriage was only confronted once people realized it in 1977. Other than that people just guessed that it was between a man and woman.

Anyways, if you have such a problem with it being taught in public school, find a private school with your similar morals. I also have to say that the way you call them "Children" is kind of degrading. Your "Children" are people too; they have reasoning, situational awareness, and a growing understanding. Sheltering them will cause more harm than good and trying to will be a catastrophe on them in the long run. Trust me, the school faculty will not be the only ones influencing your Child and thinking otherwise is pretty redundant considering I'm in Highschool and have been bombarded with Homosexuality among my peers since starting. And yet, I have not once considered entering a relationship with another man because I knew how I felt about the matter. Instead of fearing what others will teach your offspring, teach them yourself and save the trouble.

Lastly, I hope your next reply will be a little more informed instead of Rhetorical Questions and Conditonal Requirements. Regardless of what you believe, this is a debate and you do one of two things in a debate: Prove the other wrong or get them to conform with your ideals. Just saying how you feel and hoping someone agrees is not a debate, you asked for this.......and I am happy to serve. I apologize if I come off as a jerk, I'm pretty passionate about this sort of thing. Ask my Comrade Golden Ike......

1. Actually, biblical teachings are no longer allowed in public schools and that rule has been more strongly enforced than it previously was. The only time they talk about religion is when they talk about its origins in history, in which they always use the word "beliefs", and teach more than just one. The way segregation is taught to us is in which ways that people like Martin Luther King Jr. and Rosa Parks come off as heroes. Stereotypes can not help but be talked about in schools, because overcoming them is a major part of our American history, such as the Civil War.

2. Children do have some awareness, but at such grades as 1st and 2nd, where it was being taught, they are more vulnerable and unknowing. Keeping our younger children (is that better) away from gay influence will make them less likely to become gay. Any of them that do become homosexual will be terrorized by their peers in further education, such as junior high and high school.

Also, parents shouldn't have to pay hundreds of dollars to keep their younger children away from homosexual teachers, especially during the economic problems our country is facing. If homosexuality is introduced at a younger age, even slightly, by the educational authority, it will have much more of an impact than hearing a couple friends talking about someone being gay on the playground. When it is more of a talked about subject, it is usually at a higher age, when you have matured more and have a sense of values and what you think is right.

I, have no problem with it.
What if gay people were just another race.
would it be any different?
I thought we were ALL equal.
I think that it really doesn't matter if you're gar or not. You're still human aren't you? You'd think that humans with one little diffrence, their sexual orientation, would determine what kind of rights they get.

the thing is, they aren't a race, and they can be gay, they have all rights of normal people. Everyone has the right to traditional marriage. We aren't taking rights from any group in particular.

Gay marriage is completly ok

Now tyler, lets say that you had some little fettish, and you didn't see anything wrong with it at all. Then, all of a sudden, people start saying it's a bad thing, and it's immoral. Wouldn't you try to defend this and make the same point to someone else?

Everyone is different, and having same sex attractions is just one of those things that helps diversify the human race.

once again, im not saying they can't be gay. im saying its best to not spread the fetish to younger children.

tyler_robert wrote:

2. Children do have some awareness, but at such grades as 1st and 2nd, where it was being taught, they are more vulnerable and unknowing. Keeping our younger children (is that better) away from gay influence will make them less likely to become gay. Any of them that do become homosexual will be terrorized by their peers in further education, such as junior high and high school.

In this paragraph, you basicly state that being gay is bad...When the reality of it is, homosexuality is fine. It's a part of life.

And who cares if they teach it to kids? It just helps them get a sence that they can be whoever they want to be, and like whoever they want to like without being frowned upon.

I have never said it is immoral. I said it goes against some peoples beliefs and morals, but I never said it was immoral. I do believe it's immoral, but thats not a good argument because not all people believe in God and the bible.

Keeping kids away from being homosexual is a good thing to do, because if they are homosexual, they will be ridiculed and bullied by their peers.

They won't be ridiculed for it if everyone is taught that it is an ok thing.

tyler_robert wrote:

2. Children do have some awareness, but at such grades as 1st and 2nd, where it was being taught, they are more vulnerable and unknowing. Keeping our younger children (is that better) away from gay influence will make them less likely to become gay. Any of them that do become homosexual will be terrorized by their peers in further education, such as junior high and high school.

In this paragraph, you basicly state that being gay is bad...When the reality of it is, homosexuality is fine. It's a part of life.

Once again, did I say that I would do anything to homosexual people? NO
You can't honestly tell me that people don't ridicule homosexuals.
They will be ridiculed. Everyone is trying to teach people that being of a different race is okay.
Minorities are still racially harassed. I myself have dealt with these problems.
In the sense of ridicule, gays will be even more ridiculed than minorities.

I'm saying that if it's taught in schools, then more people will see that it is ok, and therefore less people ridiculing it.

No. I hate to use race again, because they really aren't similar. But they do have one similarity: People are ridiculed for it.

Racial diversity is taught in schools as slavery. Many people think that it was so wrong that they treated blacks badly, yet they still insult people for it.

Gay marriage taught in schools will not improve homosexual ridicule by much, if any at all, but will cause an uproar of angry parents.

Well then I think that the parents should just stop their complaining and deal with it. It's a good thing to teach differences in schools, because it can help people see both sides in a way. It shows that being different isn't a bad thing. Just like being black or asian isn't bad either.

You know, I hate how people always say that blacks and Asians are always ridiculed. I'm white and I'm a minority in CA. I've had to deal with countless numbers of racists here. People calling me "cracker", "slaveholder", and all sorts of crap like that.

Well being white isn't a bad thing either though.

Quote :

1. Actually, biblical teachings are no longer allowed in public schools and that rule has been more strongly enforced than it previously was. The only time they talk about religion is when they talk about its origins in history, in which they always use the word "beliefs", and teach more than just one. The way segregation is taught to us is in which ways that people like Martin Luther King Jr. and Rosa Parks come off as heroes. Stereotypes can not help but be talked about in schools, because overcoming them is a major part of our American history, such as the Civil War.

2. Children do have some awareness, but at such grades as 1st and 2nd, where it was being taught, they are more vulnerable and unknowing. Keeping our younger children (is that better) away from gay influence will make them less likely to become gay. Any of them that do become homosexual will be terrorized by their peers in further education, such as junior high and high school

I was refering to the segragation of stereotypes in the school setting. "Cliques" in highschool, seperates students based on their looks or interests and homosexuality is no different. But SlashDuffIzzy raised a good point:

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They won't be ridiculed for it if everyone is taught that it is an ok thing.

You've just gotten my complete respect Slash.

Anyways Tyler, Slash has a point. You say you don't want Homosexuality to be taught in schools so young children do not consider being homosexual themselves, and wont be criticized by their peers. But if the children are taught about it and understand that it's okay, then they wont be criticized by the general population (Only minor groups of extremists, which is similar todays standing on a persons race).

Quote :

Also, parents shouldn't have to pay hundreds of dollars to keep their younger children away from homosexual teachers, especially during the economic problems our country is facing. If homosexuality is introduced at a younger age, even slightly, by the educational authority, it will have much more of an impact than hearing a couple friends talking about someone being gay on the playground. When it is more of a talked about subject, it is usually at a higher age, when you have matured more and have a sense of values and what you think is right.

You still have the choice of teaching your younger children about Homosexuaity at anytime if you fear that others will do it.

I thank you for extending your argument and accepting my challenge. This is getting pretty fun!

Quote :

Anyways Tyler, Slash has a point. You say you don't want Homosexuality to be taught in schools so young children do not consider being homosexual themselves, and wont be criticized by their peers. But if the children are taught about it and understand that it's okay, then they wont be criticized by the general population (Only minor groups of extremists, which is similar todays standing on a persons race).

Please refer to my previous statement. Even if everyone is taught, there will still be groups of people who do not accept the fact that they are people also.

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You still have the choice of teaching your younger children about Homosexuaity at anytime if you fear that others will do it.

I suppose that is true, but it is not an easy thing to do, and you must realize the amount of irresponsible parents who send there kid to school without a care in the world. Kids under these circumstances are the ones who are most impressionable, and most likely to become homosexual. If we let them grow up just hearing other kids talking about it, they are less likely to become homosexual and face the many challenges of homosexual life.

EDIT: NEVER MIND
All I said was in Slash's post ;_;

Living Shadow[quote] wrote:

Quote :

Anyways Tyler, Slash has a point. You say you don't want Homosexuality to be taught in schools so young children do not consider being homosexual themselves, and wont be criticized by their peers. But if the children are taught about it and understand that it's okay, then they wont be criticized by the general population (Only minor groups of extremists, which is similar todays standing on a persons race).

Please refer to my previous statement. Even if everyone is taught, there will still be groups of people who do not accept the fact that they are people also.

You just rephrased what I had said in the parenthesis. I read your earlier statement and I understand your aggravation with the reference to race but it is true. Many people dont understand how to treat others who are different from them but if Universal (Race, Age, Gender, Sexual Orientation, etc.) Acceptance is tuaght to younger, impressionable children, the ridicule you talked about is one step closer to being snuffed out.

Quote :

Quote :

You still have the choice of teaching your younger children about Homosexuaity at anytime if you fear that others will do it.

I suppose that is true, but it is not an easy thing to do, and you must realize the amount of irresponsible parents who send there kid to school without a care in the world. Kids under these circumstances are the ones who are most impressionable, and most likely to become homosexual. If we let them grow up just hearing other kids talking about it, they are less likely to become homosexual and face the many challenges of homosexual life.

The Universal Acceptance I spoke about above; While not immediate; it is possible. Even if your the only one who starts it....your still starting it.

I will repeat that I hold no real standing in this argument and am only disagreeing with your original statements.

Everything Tid said was exactly correct. Plus, if you teach it to the kids while they are still really young, and don't already have a negative view on sexual orientation, then they can accept it easier and quicker so that everyone can just move on with their lives.

Tiduseya wrote:

You just rephrased what I had said in the parenthesis. I read your earlier statement and I understand your aggravation with the reference to race but it is true. Many people dont understand how to treat others who are different from them but if Universal (Race, Age, Gender, Sexual Orientation, etc.) Acceptance is tuaght to younger, impressionable children, the ridicule you talked about is one step closer to being snuffed out.



The Universal Acceptance I spoke about above; While not immediate; it is possible. Even if your the only one who starts it....your still starting it.

I will repeat that I hold no real standing in this argument and am only disagreeing with your original statements.

you seem to have contradicted your own statement. You agree that there are groups of unaccepting people when you teach them, yet you say teaching them at a young age will help.
Sorry for not putting long arguments anymore, I've gotten kind of bored with this topic.

Living Shadow wrote:

Tiduseya wrote:

You just rephrased what I had said in the parenthesis. I read your earlier statement and I understand your aggravation with the reference to race but it is true. Many people dont understand how to treat others who are different from them but if Universal (Race, Age, Gender, Sexual Orientation, etc.) Acceptance is tuaght to younger, impressionable children, the ridicule you talked about is one step closer to being snuffed out.



The Universal Acceptance I spoke about above; While not immediate; it is possible. Even if your the only one who starts it....your still starting it.

I will repeat that I hold no real standing in this argument and am only disagreeing with your original statements.

you seem to have contradicted your own statement. You agree that there are groups of unaccepting people when you teach them, yet you say teaching them at a young age will help.
Sorry for not putting long arguments anymore, I've gotten kind of bored with this topic.

I meant that teaching them at a young age will help in the long run. I understand the effect will not be instant but as a generation of Universal Acceptance rises, the older generations will fall. This kind of idealisic dream would take decades to reach it's goal, but like I said before; It will help in the long run.

Your last sentence was disrespectful to everyone involved. You started this Topic to debate the issue of Gay Marraige and now you're bored of it? I can understand the portion about not putting "long" arguments because the base argument should be the longest posts, but to get bored because of an unknown reason is sad. If you really have gotten bored, please end the Debate with a Synopsis of the opposing aguments and then I will lock it.

Whoa Asakura...that was intense lol.

You hit alot of the points that Tid and I agree on lol.

And as far as I know, Mii and I are the only ones allowed to vote here.